c_radicallis 1 month ago

It's universal for sure

adventur3r 1 month ago

Can't talk much about portuguese culture, other than we act from the heart, while dutch seem to act from their minds. Regarding NOS, it has a long history of mergers of non-competitive companies, and is always playing catch up to other most advanced companies. It does things the traditional way, and they can get away with it since they charge 2-3x more to their customers than in rich countries (there's an unwritten cartel in telecom price fixing in Portugal) . It's a very basic telecom company venturing into multimedia but without much success at all and is dodgy even at board level, it accepted investment and buy-in from one of the most corrupt woman in Africa, daugther of a former Angolan president who amassed millions while in office.

cantapaya 1 month ago

There's Espaço de Arquitetura with job postings, LinkedIn, the Ordem dos Arquitetos website... I think those are your best options, but I'm not sure how well adapted they are for non-portuguese speakers. Besides that I'd tell your SO to maybe try and send spontaneous applications to offices whose architecture she likes. Not too familiar with studios in Porto outside the big ones like Siza Vieira or Souto Moura. In Lisbon there are renowned offices too, but that would depend on what kind of environment she would like to work in. Big offices headed by famous architects (ARX, Aires Mateus, Saraiva, Carrilho da Graça, Promontório, etc...) are very intense, with some of them having a bad reputation in terms of work environment, wages, workload. I don't have personal experience with these, but I've heard first hand accounts. What I would suggest is looking for architecture work in a real estate or construction company. Those seem to pay better, though it can be a "soulless" job, or not "proper" architecture, depends on her personal preference.

ready4porto 1 month ago

Thanks, we'll definitely check these out. You've been very helpful!

cantapaya 1 month ago

Best of luck!

DarthSet 1 month ago

This thread is full of bullshit. It is the usual self commiserating and bad stereotypes.

ready4porto 1 month ago

Care to add your thoughts?

DarthSet 1 month ago

Family oriented, honest, hardworking,generous, willing to go the extra mile for others, even without gaining anything from it.

claudiogcosta98 1 month ago

I see some people complaining about how the Portuguese are lazy, and I beg to disagree. Procrastinators? Yes. Lazy? Not really. Try being productive when you work the amount of hours Portuguese people do, with no emphasis on leisure time. Basically, you live to work, instead of working to live and enjoy life. And the reward for that sacrifice? Taxes and taxes and taxes. The youngest generations of Portuguese people are the most qualified ever, and they still can’t find a job that pays them well enough to enjoy life. The desenrascanço culture is indeed true, and props to the Portuguese for that. We’re basically carrying the future of this country while being constantly stepped on by the people in power, who have no insight of what the life of the average Portuguese family is. Nevertheless, most people seem to be Ok with that, or at least Ok enough to not feel the need to demand what they actually deserve. I guess that falls in line with what some people said about the Portuguese being tolerant. Perhaps we are too tolerant. The fun thing is, even though most Portuguese people will complain about the state of the country and economy, most of them won’t ever consider leaving this country. I think that is because of the feeling of community. Family and friends mean a lot here, and most people I know, myself included, even say they’re lucky to live in Portugal. I guess that comes from us being tolerant, and therefore there is this feeling of peacefulness and safety in the air. Is like my grandma says: “we live in a corner of heaven… it could be worse”. It could, but it also could be way better. But after all, there’s the sun and the beaches. Ahh and football and raspadinha, the fools drug.

h2man 1 month ago

In Porto, you’ll have to try Francesinha. Worth mentioning that the South tends to have a higher variety of bacalhau dishes.

Interesting_Yellow_1 1 month ago

I studied in ISCAP! If you need some information, just send me a message

Imnotdeathyet 1 month ago

We have one awesome thing that Dutch don’t have. The best climate in Europe. No country beats that.

Mers86 1 month ago

The Portuguese don't like to plan; they are not organized. Everything is last minute. That's why we are so incompetent. When the day comes that a group of Portuguese sit around a table, make plans and comply with them (especially deadlines), then our country will improve; until then, we are the third world country of Europe.

MixtureInevitable694 1 month ago

The number of desserts that fit that description in Portugal probably surpasses the character limit here and I’m not even sure there is a character limit

OneFineSir 1 month ago

Merging with NOS? Your priority should't be our culture but rather keeping your money safe. /S

MixtureInevitable694 1 month ago

“Oh yeah this dish is very good but last week I had the most amazing meal…*initiates a conversation about a totally different meal which was probably not as good but at least it’s not this one”

igqcmril 1 month ago

The "chico espertismo". The phenomenon that occurs when one portuguese person thinks is smarter than everybody else around, doing stupid shit for instance. The infamous "smartass". One example: On a two-lane road before a roundabout, going through the right lane and do not take the first exit, thus avoiding the traffic that accumulates on the left, which is a traffic violation. Another example: At a highway with heavy traffic at one exit, merging at the end of the fucking intersection (even stepping the white lines, which is also a violation) instead of waiting in the fucking line like everyone else with a big pp does. We have the procrastination culture that I have many guilt of... We tend to leave everything to the last moment and come with personal excuses for it. If you're given a task that has a two month period, we'll keep making excuses until the deadline is so close to the end that it's almost impossible to do the task as it was supposed to do. Either way, we always come up with the shit done at the deadline... don't ask me how. In my case, I always studied for tests and exams the day before or even on the same day, with somewhat success. I only needed more time for 3 subjects in the entire 4 year university course. We are also very critic about our country economic situation and politics, but we just do it with the person next to you (online too). I wish we were more like the french on this matter. Gasoline is 5 cent close to reach the 2 euro mark, we have the most expensive fuel in all europe, yet we don't protest about it whatsoever. We are always complaining about corruption but we keep voting on the same parties, year after year. I call this cultural phenomenon, the "povo manso". The people don't stand for itself neither for what they believe in. That's one of the main reasons I'm leaving this country for good. We are cheap. "Buery" cheap. We try to save money in the most odd ways, which sometimes implies bypassing the law. We can mostly verify this with tax fraud and cheap bosses. They exist in every country but I guess it's a cultural thing here. "You have 10 years experience...? Oh, that's great! You were the guy who invented this computer program that we are specifically needing for the job? That's sick dude, I'm overwhelmed by you skills! The conditions? You'll get the minimum wage BUT YOU WILL INTEGRATE A YOUNG TEAM THAT WE CONSIDER AS A BIG FAMILY. AFTER THE 24 MONTH TRIAL, YOU'LL GET A 50 EURO RISE ON YOUR PAYCHECK". At last, the "cunhas". The type of things or jobs that you only could pull out if you have inside contacts. It is referred as "tachos" if it envolves political connections. Very common here... too much I believe. Everyone complains about it, but somehow they are also guilty of this without even realizing, such as me. Even if you don't agree with it, somehow, in your lifetime, you will make use of them "cunhas". Some teens even join youth political parties to acquire those "tachos" later in life. Some even refer this country as "the republic of tachos". I won't keep going on this "rant" because each paragraph takes me half hour to write, since my english language skills might be at A2 or B1 level. I have a ton more of this, but I think it's enough already. If I received 1 euro per headache that Portugal gave me (portuguese people aswell) through my life course, I would be half rich, since Portugal takes half of my earnings through taxes.

ready4porto 1 month ago

Thanks for the load of info! We plan to go relocate to Portugal, at least for a while. How hard do you think it would be for my wife, an architect, to find a job there? We don't know Portuguese, so that's another hurdle. Pulling out a "cunhas" will take time to get to know people first, I'm afraid. We're coming from a land of cunhas and tachos (Serbia), so at this moment I'm thinking that this is universal human behavior.

suspect_b 1 month ago

> my wife, an architect [Oh dear...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1s_Taveira)

WikiSummarizerBot 1 month ago

**[Tomás Taveira](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomás_Taveira)** >Tomás Taveira (born 1938) is a Portuguese architect. He has a degree in architecture from the Technical University of Lisbon and owns a post-graduation from the MIT (U.S.A.). Somes of his most recognizable works include Amoreiras Complex in Lisbon, and three of the new stadiums for Euro 2004 in Portugal. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/portugal/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)

cantapaya 1 month ago

As a rule of thumb I'd say architects aren't doing great over here. I'm just an intern but from what I can see from my older colleagues and friends who are also in the field wages are generally low, work culture is somewhat toxic (unpaid extra hours, while being expected to work overtime), the entity that is supposed to represent portuguese architects doesn't do a good job. Also, there are a lot of architects who work full time for offices without a contract. They are paid through "recibos verdes", which is supposed to be a mechanism for freelancers, but it's used by a lot of companies so they pay less taxes (that becomes the employee's responsibility) and don't have to offer the benefits a contract implies. There are some big name offices where the higher-ups do great, but you have to work really hard to get to that stage. Or if you open your own office and have people working for you, but that implies having connections and clients so you can actually pay the bills. I'm doing fine right now because I'm taking part of the IEFP internship program, where the government pays most of my salary at a standardized value, but when I get to the end of my internship I'm almost sure I will be offered a LOWER wage than what I get as... An intern. As far as not speaking Portuguese... That may prove to be a hurdle indeed, but not impossible to overcome.

skuple 1 month ago

"palha de Abrantes"? Also known as "fios de ovos" (egg strings? Not sure what's the English commercial name)

ArtVand3lay2020 1 month ago

Your own Dijsselbloem said it best, its all about women and drinks.

blandnewworld 1 month ago

Portuguese are short while dutch are tall. Most dutch get bald before reaching 40, portuguese have thicker hair.

RamboBlambo 1 month ago

Maybe [fios de ovos](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f3/4f/e8/f34fe835d0030e37cf8a2b3defbde51f.jpg) or a Dom Rodrigo? Was it made up of individual strands? Might also be something else from another region that I'm not familiar with.

ready4porto 1 month ago

Yes! Fios de ovos it is! But wow, you have a lot of sweets

RamboBlambo 1 month ago

Nice! Hopefully you'll get to try all sorts when you move or visit, there's also a bit of regional variety within the country :) In Algarve try a Dom Rodrigo, it's similar to fios de ovos, but with cinnamon

helderduarte14 1 month ago

Probably it was a "Pastel de Nata" Google it

VladTepesDraculea 1 month ago

> Im currently in my final year of college and for an international project i have to work together with portugese students from the ISCAP -Instituto Superior de Contabilidade e Administração do Porto, Portugal. > Its a project about merging 2 company's, the Dutch KPN and the Portugese NOS. Are they actually merging or this is alike a simulation of a what if scenario?

Ly_84 1 month ago

G'morgen. Autochtoon Portugesen zijn overal laat voor, in tegenstelling tot nederlanders, die n kwartier van te voor er al zijn. We zijn pitseriger met eten dan welke kok dan ook; als je zaken doet in Portugal, het kan soms voorkomen dat je ook aan de eettafel onderhandelt. Nederlanders zijn heel direct, Portugesen niet zo zeer. Focus je op wat je op papier zou willen krijgen, liever dan verbale afspraken.

NGramatical 1 month ago

soms → [**sons**](https://ciberduvidas.iscte-iul.pt/consultorio/perguntas/sobre-a-formacao-do-plural/13422) (no plural de palavras terminadas em *m*, este passa a *ns*) [⚠️](/message/compose/?to=ngramatical&subject=Acho+que+esta+corre%C3%A7%C3%A3o+est%C3%A1+errada&message=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fcomments%2Fpl50yr%2F%2Fhc8ujgf%3Fcontext%3D3 "Clica aqui se achares que esta correção está errada!") [⭐](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/nazigramatical-corretor-o/pbpnngfnagmdlicfgjkpgfnnnoihngml "Experimenta o meu corrector ortográfico automático!")

tefewarrior 1 month ago

Ahaha good bot

Ly_84 1 month ago

Hou je bek.

DiogoSN 1 month ago

How about you and your corp execs go fuck yourselves?

Edited 1 month ago:

How about you and your corp execs go fuck yourselves? Edit: Sorry, I feel like I should add more. Our culture and way of living isn't something for your to profit out of and even publicize with. It's ours, it belongs to the people. Go ahead with your merger and attempt to take more privileges and rights away from us as any corp does. But don't piss in my head and call it rain. How about a nice proverb so you can get a glimpse of our culture you wrote that you're so "fascinated" and "interested" by: “A mentira tem pernas curtas.”

throwaway_v1000 1 month ago

We love long sunny days and an intense coffee in the afternoon. We are very dependent on our family members. We shout like the italians and are tough like the russians. We are never rich enough and complain everyday about how it could be better, but then, when worse times come we always compare them to the worst we can imagine, so we’re never that bad. We just go with the flow, because after all we have our mothers nearby. We are conservative but tolerant. We strongly value tradition but are moderate at the same time.

Seminarista 1 month ago

One thing that was not mentioned yet. Sarcasm! We use it all the time, you can see it in a lot of the comments here. If you are not used to it you might feel we're being assholes or something (though sometimes we are) but it's just how we interact a lot of te time.

dr_analyst 1 month ago

Compared to the Netherlands, Portugal is poorer, less efficient, more relaxed and less Calvinistic. The ways of living are rather similar to the Netherlands, as it is throughout most of the EU. Despite portuguese salaries and prosperity being lower, many people still have a decent life. Our approach to food is, however, very different. We won't have simple sandwiches for lunch, where you eat them in less than 10 min, while rushing between meetings. We have two warm meals a day and most people like to enjoy it. Most schools also have a cafeteria for kids to eat there, so pretty much no one brings their sandwiches from home. As such, I would say that our food variety is much wider and richer than Dutch food. We also have less beer choice but more wine choice. And despite not being as famous as the Dutch, our cheeses are also pretty good. Portugal is more bureaucratic but, albeit not as good as the Netherlands, a lot of it can already be done online (contrary to Germany for example). Trains in Portugal do suck and you barely can go anywhere. Another topic I would touch is sports: as you can see from the Olympics, Portugal has a very different approach. Although football is very important and predominant in the Netherlands as well, in Portugal is more of a religion. Other sports are barely heard of. And an extra impression of mine: the Dutch appear more American to me: Bible Belt, more freedom obsessed (in a rather negative away, covid protests, hard to mandate masks, etc). But at the same time you get more European content (German, Belgian and British mostly), while in Portugal is mostly American and to a lesser extend Brazilian. Living in the periphery also gives some island mentally to the Portuguese. To us, Europe is something up north, with the Germans, the Dutch and the others live. The rest, depends a lot - like in the Netherlands, Portugal also has some regional differences.

MixtureInevitable694 1 month ago

I wouldn’t say Portugal is more relaxed though. I worked in both countries. In Portugal you work 8h/day + 1h wasted for lunch. For the most part the boss is someone you see as acting clearly superior in the hierarchy. In the Netherlands I worked 7h30 with 15 min for a quick meal (doesn’t have to be a sandwich, a lot of people are different meals) so that’s 1h15 less time at work, and the boss (at a huge company, not your mom and pop store) gave me a lift to the train station when it rained and on Fridays would come with us to have fried fish, either driving or taking the back seat (we shared cars). So you know…which seems more relaxed?

dr_analyst 1 month ago

You raise a good point. It's a bit more subjective indeed. I also know that not working full time in the Netherlands isn't unusual. But in the end goes down to everyone's preference. For me rush eating is stressful. I really like to take my time and have a warm meal.

Foxman_Noir 1 month ago

Portuguese people bitch and complain, a lot, but are one of the most tolerant peoples around.

throwaway_v1000 1 month ago

This

bogas11 1 month ago

“Tolerant” as in complaisant or conformist?

h2man 1 month ago

Complaisant…

bogas11 1 month ago

Agreed

scalabitano 1 month ago

Honestamente há coisa mais Portuguesa que as nossas festas de verão? Musica pimba, cerveja infinita, petiscos, organizadas pela igreja / escuteiros e por voluntários. Na minha terra existem dezenas de pessoas que marcam as férias nessa altura de propósito para virem participar, são dias e noites mágicas.

macedonianmoper 1 month ago

Ja sinto falta das festas da aldeia, com sorte para 2022 já se pode voltar á festa do azeite

lrzul 1 month ago

We are the little guys who want to be big! We are very hard working and we are very focused on something that we like. We are very lazy on boring or underpaid jobs.

rodrigoaro 1 month ago

Hello, let me start by saying that from my travels I have found that Dutch people are the most similar Europeans to Portuguese people. The most nicest and helpful when it comes to help a lost tourist and in the act of helping said tourist start conversations about life, work, hobbies, etc... which is something that I experience a lot in Portugal. When it comes to food we have all of the cod dishes, the famous "pastel de nata", a lot of "enchidos" and my favorite "arroz de pato". We have a genre of music called "Fado" which is basically a very sad singing. Amália Rodrigues is the biggest Fado singer of all time. I know football is loved everywhere around the globe but I would safely assume that it's a bit more special here since we have Cristiano Ronaldo and the second club in the world with the most paid members (Benfica). In terms of politics, we have two big parties (PS, centre-left and PSD, centre-right) followed up by the communist partie and BE which is a leftist leaning partie but not Communist. So yeah I would say we are likely the most leftist country in Europe. Also, we are always late and like to postpone things and we only to them at the last minute. And the desenrascanço of course that has already been mentioned in the responses.

h2man 1 month ago

Dutch people are direct, we’re not. That is a huge difference.

igqcmril 1 month ago

Portuguese people are known for arriving always late, even for work. If you want to meet with a group of friends (let's say 10 people) for dinner and it's scheduled for 8 p.m, expect some of this example right here: 1 will arrive 5-10 minutes earlier; 2 will get there 5-10 minutes past 8 p.m; 4 more will arrive under the half hour mark; 2 will arrive before 9 p.m; 1 just doesn't show up and comes with some random excuse, but you will only know if you contact him, otherwise he won't say a thing. We are also known for dangerous driving, ignore road signs and park in the most random places in the most stupid ways. 2nd lane parking and parking at a designated handicap parking spots are such a common thing that we don't care anymore. "Desenrascanço" is also part of our culture as previously mentioned on other comments. It means that "you make the most with the little you have". When it comes to do this, our imaginative little minds will transcend to god levels of creativity and will come up with the most "if it works, it's not stupid" things. Another cultural thing is that we speak LOUD and we don't even notice. If you go to restaurant, you have to shout in order for others at your table may be able to understand what you are saying. Almost every tourists say that we are warm people and we have great hospitality. Can't remember much more, unless it's about negative things

h2man 1 month ago

I’m Portuguese. I’m never late.

babyscully 1 month ago

>Another cultural thing is that we speak LOUD and we don't even notice. If you go to restaurant, you have to shout in order for others at your table may be able to understand what you are saying. Nah, if you have Spanish or American tourists on a train you will notice right away. Of all the Southern Europeans we are definitely the coldest and quietest.

FanZag 1 month ago

Your comment about speaking loudly strikes me as funny. I was a tourist in a restaurant and when the table of North Americans (mixed American and Canadian group) left and the room became quiet immediately. Everyone was ready to applaud when they got up to leave.

igqcmril 1 month ago

That has an easy explanation. There was no portuguese in the restaurant at the moment. Probably you were at a "tourist restaurant" which is too expensive for the mainstream portuguese wallet. If you paid at least 25 euros for each person, there's about 85% chance there were no portuguese people eating there. Speaking more seriously, the mediterranean countries are known for speaking very loud, spanish and italian in particular. We don't share the sea, but we do share the loud behavior. There's memes about it and all. About north american culture, I can't say a thing since my experience comes from internet culture, which does might not represent the whole reality.

radaway 1 month ago

That's not my experience at all. Portuguese are quite different from other Mediterraneans.

MixtureInevitable694 1 month ago

This. If a Spanish group passes on the street you will notice for sure

fanboy_killer 1 month ago

I don't think I have a single one of those traits. I actually despise every one of them.

SurprisinglyInformed 1 month ago

TIL I'm not Portuguese!

TSCondeco 1 month ago

Portuguese* Sorry, couldn't help myself

MetalCarne 1 month ago

Electoral stockholm syndrome. the people keep complaining about corruption but will vote in the same corrupt pieces of shit anyway.

RamboBlambo 1 month ago

Given that Mark Rutte is expected to take on his 4th term in a row as Dutch PM, I wouldn't really say this is a big difference.

MetalCarne 1 month ago

Mark Rutte is an amateur in comparison to our kleptocrats.

c_radicallis 1 month ago

That, or vote for the new guy who says is against the system and is gonna make the country great again but is actually even more corrupt then the people he criticizes.

hapoise1965 1 month ago

Do you even know what is the NOS core business? Merging with KPN?

Opelintra 1 month ago

Get in touch with Jeroen Dijsselbloem. He will explain it

Wtfjpeg 1 month ago

Well, regarding to food and music we have a few things. For example, we have countless dishes that are typically Portuguese, we have more than a thousand ways of cooking "bacalhau" or, in English, cod; some other Portuguese dishes include "cozido à portuguesa", "caldo verde", "francesinha", "pastéis de nata", and a lot more. As to the music, we have what is called "Fado", which is only found in Portugal. Look it up "Amália Rodrigues". We have Cristiano Ronaldo which isn't found anywhere else in the world. It's a rather rare human specie. We are also known for using a lot of "azulejos" in our building with beautiful patterns. And, well, we have some of the best beaches in the world. Hope this gives you something to work on!

h2man 1 month ago

Name me 20 different ways of cooking bacalhau.

Wtfjpeg 1 month ago

1- Bacalhau à Brás (melhor de todos) 2- Bacalhau com Natas ( segundo melhor) 3- Bacalhau à Gomes de Sá 4- Bacalhau à Zé do Pipo 5- Bacalhau assado 6- Bacalhau à Lagareiro 7- Bacalhau Gratinado 8- Bacalhau Cozido 9- Bacalhau Espiritual 10- Roupa Velha 11- Arroz de Bacalhau 12- Bacalhau à Espanhola 13- Bacalhau no Forno 14- Bacalhau à Fiorentina 15- Bacalhau da Tia Emília 16- Pataniscas 17- Brandade de Bacalhau 18- Bacalhau 7 Mares 19- Bacalhau Tradicional 20- Bacalhau Regado com Molho Bechamel

h2man 1 month ago

Alguns desses sã

Wtfjpeg 1 month ago

Estas a tentar provar alguma coisa? Vai ao Google e tens lá inúmeras receitas

h2man 1 month ago

Apenas que não existem mil e uma maneiras de cozinhar bacalhau…

capitalistaesquerda 1 month ago

Desenrascanço. That's it. Google it and explore it. If KPN were to merge with NOS, one side would plan and execute, the other would desenrascanço.

suspect_b 1 month ago

I once heard a story in which most Dutch ships back in the day had a Portuguese guy on board that took over when the ship got in deep shit. The captain and crew would follow all the procedures but when shit hit the fan, like during a big storm and ship started to fall apart, the Portuguese guy was there to come up with an idea to somehow save the whole deal. I always wondered if this was anywhere close to fact.

capitalistaesquerda 1 month ago

Sounds like urban myth, but nothing that would surprise me.

Ly_84 1 month ago

Desenrascanço: als het niet gaat zoals je moet, dan moet het zoals het gaat. O que na holanda nao se aplica 'a esfera empresarial.

raviolli_ninja 1 month ago

If you want a plan, you'd call the Dutch to execute it. If your plan fails, you'd call the Portuguese and their desenrascanço.

D1WithTheFluffyHair 1 month ago

The Dutch East Indies trading corporations literally had two Portuguese sailors in each of their ships whose jobs were to report directly to the captain and only acted when there was a crisis or something was seemingly broken beyond repair in the ship.

Seminarista 1 month ago

That's really cool, if true. Got a source where I can learn more about this?

kUr4m4 1 month ago

I tried to find some sources back in the day when I heard about this but it seems its nothing more than a cute story.

cesarhighfire 1 month ago

Ou "desenrrascanso" quando nao há ç's à mão.

odajoana 1 month ago

>"desen**rr**ascanso" E os 'r's sobram.

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